Author Topic: OSTK - Overstock.com  (Read 109188 times)

no_free_lunch

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #350 on: January 09, 2018, 06:25:44 AM »
I went through the verification process completely and was informed that from Dec 16 - Jan 16 the ICO was open to a "select group" of investors only (I did not make that cut), and Jan 16 - Feb 16 it will open to all verified accredited investors.  I was expecting to be given some type of information like a prospectus or an info packet or something, but so far I have been sent nothing.  Hopefully they will provide some details before Jan 16.  I don't know if I would invest anyway, but I certainly won't be throwing money into a black box.

Thanks for the feedback!  Good to hear from someone who got verified.

This is a really tough one for me.  On the one hand, I can see scenarios where OSTK goes to $200,$300,$500.. who f'ing knows.   You look at some of the other currencies with valuations in the 10s of billions and yet tzero is probably better capitalized, is in a large "niche" market and has been at it for similar time frames.  There is also the investments from some big players.

On the other hand.. the lack of disclosure bugs me.  The fact that disclosure is happening via conference calls bothers me.  The fact that Byrne thows out a valuation of $5B for tzero and then later $10B, not a fan.  The warrants to soros, like $2 for warrants on a $40 stock that has just tripled?  Way too cheap in my opinion.  The fact that the existing business has been at best mediocre is a concern. 

Honestly the only reason I am even thinking about this is it might be a bit safer way to play the crypto space and I do see a disconnect between their valuation and other crypto's.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 06:34:44 AM by no_free_lunch »


rkbabang

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #351 on: January 10, 2018, 10:38:32 AM »
I just received another update email from SAFTlaunch about the t0 ICO.  No new info, but it mentions that I will be getting a " offering memorandum" "on or about January 18, 2018".

Quote
Thank you for your patience and support.  In recent months, we have had unprecedented user volume and are working feverishly to process potential investors registering to participate in tZERO's security token offering. Please see below for an update on the tZERO offering on SAFTLaunch.

While the pre-sale period is currently open to certain strategic investors, all other qualified investors will begin having access to the offering memorandum and SAFE on or about January 18, 2018.

Please look for emails from support@SAFTLaunch.com with the subject "tZERO qualified investors" in the coming days.

rkbabang

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #352 on: January 17, 2018, 12:06:21 PM »
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20180116006759/en/tZERO-Trade-KODAKCoin-Future-U.S.-Regulated-Security

tZERO to Trade KODAKCoin on Its Future U.S. Regulated Security Token Trading Platform

NEW YORK--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Overstock.com’s blockchain subsidiary, t0.com, Inc. (“tZERO”) announced today its intent to provide advisory services to WENN Digital in connection with its recently announced KODAKCoin Security Token Offering. In addition, tZERO will advise on secondary trading of the KODAKCoin.

The parties intend that the KODAKCoin will launch in Q1 2018. KODAKCoin will be the first third-party security token to launch on the security token platform that tZERO is developing...

no_free_lunch

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #353 on: January 20, 2018, 07:09:07 AM »
Is there any word on the ICO phase 2?  Phase 1 was supposed to have completed by now.  I see nothing in the news or edgar so I will have to assume it is still on-going, and delayed.

rkbabang

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #354 on: January 20, 2018, 10:38:42 AM »
Is there any word on the ICO phase 2?  Phase 1 was supposed to have completed by now.  I see nothing in the news or edgar so I will have to assume it is still on-going, and delayed.

Received email yesterday which said:

“Thursday January 25th, SAFTLaunch will determine the number of people eligible to participate.  SAFTLaunch will begin emailing groups of investors all around the world with the date on which they will be able to access tZERO's token offering.  Each group will have a date range in which they MUST complete their deal subscription.  Unfortunately, no exceptions can be made for investors who miss the cut-off date of this period.  Please be prepared for the investment period”

WneverLOSE

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #355 on: January 21, 2018, 04:50:38 AM »
I'm starting to read about the Patrick Byrne story and I can't stop.
It's a mix of a business story and a real life thriller book.
I was wondering if anyone  can shine a bit more light on the connections between different characters in the story.
This is where I got so far on the business front :
Warren Buffett started investing in GEICO around the time Ben Graham was on the board, in 1975 John J. Byrne (Patrick's dad) was appointed the CEO of GEICO after it stumbled into some troubles and started a turnaround, Buffett was impressed and bought a position (eventually buying the entire company), he even went on to say that John was the "Babe Ruth of insurance." After retiring from GEICO John Byrne was invited to run the troubled Fireman's Fund, then a subsidiary of American Express. Fireman's had incurred $356 million in pretax losses in 1983 and 1984. Byrne vastly improved Fireman's financial performance and initiated a public offering of some of Fireman's shares in 1985. The company was sold to Allianz AG in 1991. Byrne retained the Fireman's holding company, which he later renamed as White Mountains Insurance Group. Allan Mecham (Arlington Value Management / Capital) is known on this board and he invest both in White Mountains, Overstock and Fairfax.
Fairfax is a long time investor in Overstock and they are known for their bet on the housing market. Someone also known for his bet on the housing market is Michael Burry of Scion Capital that was featured on the movie the big short. White Mountains were investors in Scion Capital and Scion Capital were investors in Overstock. Patrick grew up with "Uncle Buffett" and later on after he got his PhD he ran a subsidiary of Berkshire Hathaway before moving on to start Overstock. John Byrne was on the board of Overstock but due to a disagreement with his son about the time he spends about fighting wall street and naked shorting he resigned.

I would be glad to hear if I misses something regarding the investors / characters in the story of overstock and the connections between them.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2018, 05:05:30 AM by WneverLOSE »

spark411

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #356 on: January 21, 2018, 06:55:16 AM »
Few things I would add.
1.  I read somewhere that Byrne's grandfather was the head of the SEC at one time.
2.  Byrne referred to a "birdie" in Omaha who advised what aspect of the financial market needed most attention.
3.  Byrne has intimate knowledge of SEC/trading because he has been in knee deep legal battles for years.

If there is anyone with the perfect background and in place relationships to disrupt entire financial markets, Patrick Byrne is a good guy to bet on.

I've been a holder of OSTK for 7+ years.   The #1 reason is Patrick Byrne and his background/relationships.

no_free_lunch

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #357 on: January 21, 2018, 08:46:59 AM »
I own a position in OSTK so I am talking against my book here.  I have to say that I don't see what you guys see in Byrne.  I can't disagree with the pedigree but this link to Berkshire and affiliates is over a decade old.  At this point we should judge based on Byrne's performance with Overstock.  In my mind it hasn't been that spectacular.   Maybe it's just a really tough industry but that is the one he chose.

His commentary on bitcoin in conference calls is very high level and company promotional.  You see this with other successful entrepreneurs such as Musk but at least with Musk I have seen him deliver.  The history is all I have to go on, otherwise I don't know how to tell whether he can get operations going.  It is one thing to announce an idea and another to get it working.  Perhaps the stock lending thing is really moving, I don't have a way to gauge it and I guess that will come out next quarter but for now I am cautious on this one.

I know it's a small thing but that bug with bitcoin cash annoyed me.  They use a third party for the actual bitcoin transactions and it is alledged that they didn't use the API return calls properly.  As a result some researcher found a way to put transactions through using bitcoin cash instead of bitcoin without them immediately detecting it.  I think they have fixed it but really, these are the guys at the forefront of bitcoin technology?
« Last Edit: January 21, 2018, 08:51:57 AM by no_free_lunch »

WneverLOSE

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #358 on: January 21, 2018, 10:28:51 AM »
Well I'm agnostic about him, I don't like him or hate him, I don't know nearly as much as I should to have an opinion. I started taking interest lately after seeing some of the connections that I outlined and I just read about him and his company. What I do like is his intelligence, I don't think anyone can deny he is one smart cookie. The thing that I don't like is his behavior, Taking an ad on the wall street journal https://qzprod.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/screen-shot-2013-07-27-at-3-36-03-pm.png?w=640 taunting Steve Cohen (Even if the "Sith Lord" did everything Patrick claims it makes him look very bad) or sending an email to a fortune reporter asking her "why exactly did you become a reporter? Giving Goldman traders blowjobs didn't work out?" is no way to behave by my book even if she made fun or smirky remarks regarding his cancer.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2018, 10:31:22 AM by WneverLOSE »

mwtorock

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Re: OSTK - Overstock.com
« Reply #359 on: January 21, 2018, 07:34:32 PM »
I think some people are born as fighters and Patrick Byrne is one of those. Maybe he was also a spoiled child. This kind of people cant take any injustice in life. They fight even it seems no chance of winning.

I have the same concern about execution here. He may be a brilliant visionary leader in the crypo world, but we still need to see good executions. To be fair, the T0 acquisition already paying off (I was not expecting that or at least not so soon).

Also he still has much skin in this, so his best interest is aligned with shareholders...