Author Topic: America 1st  (Read 96894 times)

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America 1st
« on: June 01, 2017, 07:37:25 PM »
I wish that all of our leaders had the same ethic and courage.

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jeffmori7

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2017, 08:27:15 PM »
I must admit I don't get why isolationism could be a winning strategy for anyone, ever...

jeffmori7

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2017, 08:40:13 PM »
Oh and by the way, the Paris agreement is non-binding. USA have no obligation to do anything under it. But for once, almost all the countries on the planet had an agreement to collaborate onto something. Quitting this will just alienate many people who are your allies.

And some facts: http://mashable.com/2017/06/01/trump-paris-climate-agreement-8-signs-wrong/?utm_cid=hp-hh-sec#DFo6EgQwS5qX

LC

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2017, 09:09:54 PM »
Trump is still an idiot. Hopefully the rest of the world looks past this wart when dealing with the US in the coming decades.
"Lethargy bordering on sloth remains the cornerstone of our investment style."
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RichardGibbons

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2017, 09:32:15 PM »
It would be amusing if, during the renegotiation of NAFTA, Canada decided to add carbon tariffs to everything imported from the USA.  You can't force a win in a game of Prisoner's Dilemma, but you can certainly force the other guy to lose.

I've been reading Liu's The Three Body Problem, and, when you look at Trump and his supporters, you can kind of understand the people who decide to side with the aliens.  In a sense, Trump brings to mind the same passions and logic behind China's Cultural Revolution.

rb

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2017, 10:40:36 PM »
I guess the question is first in what? Trying to pollute themselves? Hurt the environment? We have no need for air right?

What does this solve apart from fluffing some weird obsession with coal? It's not about jobs, there won't be a lot of coal jobs created and there aren't that many jobs in coal in the US (about 84,000). There are way more jobs in clean energy than in coal. There are way more jobs in nat gas than in coal. So it's not about Jobs. Is it about profits? Lots of businesses were against this. Amazingly enough even some coal mining businesses were against this. So I don't think it's about profits. So then it's about nothing. Add on top of that that people that make/use clean energy love clean energy. People in Nevada can't put solar panels on their roofs fast enough and Iowans can't get enough of wind. Those states aren't exactly left wing bastions.

Whatever is going on makes very little sense. Even if you assume that the current administration is selfish, transnational, "greed is good" type, what is achieved? Where is the gain? Exiting Paris accord, don't get something in return. What was gained by poking allies in the eye? Nothing. This week the gov't returned to Russia sites under sanctions because they were used to gather intelligence. Did Russia provide anything in return? Nope. There are no transactions here. It's just doing belligerent stuff just cause you can do it.

LC

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2017, 10:50:13 PM »
Its not about anything rational. The dude is just playing to his base of voters.
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Parsad

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2017, 11:37:08 PM »
You are not dealing with a rational adult human being.  This guy is a petulant, spoiled, entitled, brat who doesn't play well with others.  He's a bully, a whiner, egotistical and frankly, an idiot. 

What he is good at is pushing and bullying his way around the school yard, and when given the power to do so, he doesn't mind taking his toys away from other kids and going home. His mommy and daddy have always told him how wonderful he was, how clever, handsome and talented he is and that there is no one in the world like him!  He surrounds himself with sycophants and fires those that don't feel the same way.  He was raised to worry about himself first...nothing wrong with that necessarily, and why it resonates with so many other like-minded people.

So this is what we will see for the next few years, unless he is impeached or croaks.  He will bully, lecture and cry, and then he will pull out of agreement after agreement, until others are forced to terms that he thinks are worth closing the deal on.  He did this his whole life and he will do it to the rest of the world.  America will benefit in the short-term, but will suffer in the long-term.  This is not a man of vision or inclusiveness, but short-sighted, exclusory ideals.

And it's easy to blame the Republicans or the voters you don't agree with, but he's in the position he's in because of the elitist, liberal mentality and alienating, conservative leaders that came before him that created this massive rift in society today.  Those that voted for him believe he is anti-establishment, when in fact Trump is something far worse...he's chaos!  Cheers!   
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Cardboard

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2017, 03:26:58 AM »
Next step is to build 10,000 to 15,000 of these ICBM interceptors and tell the world to fight their own battles. CO2 and socialism will be history in no time.

Regarding stupidity, hard to beat the majority of B.C. who is even opposed to an hydro power dam!

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Packer16

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Re: America 1st
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2017, 04:28:47 AM »
IMO the climate debate misses the larger point.  There are two issues here being conflated as one.  The first is about the effects of CO2 on the atmosphere.  I think given no economic impact everyone agrees the less CO2 the better.  Here you need to seperate what the biased press reports about folks & their actual views.  Second is the issue of the actual impact & the cost to mitigate.  This is the real issue.  Most of the press & others think that since  A is true we should spend trillions of dollars to prevent an unknown outcome.  This IMO is Trumps point that no one is addressing.  How rationale is B if we have other uses of the resources that have more bang for the buck.  I also hate to see science highjacked for political & monetary gain.  What you hear is a reaction of the environmental industrial complex.

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