Corner of Berkshire & Fairfax Message Board

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: cherzeca on May 13, 2020, 06:59:10 PM

Title: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: cherzeca on May 13, 2020, 06:59:10 PM
 :'(
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Viking on May 13, 2020, 07:06:35 PM
I voted just fine like it always was.

Back in late Feb and during March there was lots of Coronavirus posting. April / May it has shifted (thank god) back to investing and regular stuff. Not that Coronavirus is not important...

When i got annoyed at some posters on the coronavirus thread (i am sure it just happens to me :-) i just ignore them. I. Take a self imposed time out.

I actually like the fact that there is so much disagreement on important topics. Normally it means there is some learning to be had. Look at the Fairfax threads... i agree with both sides (depending on the day).

Coronavirus is just the primer... the real story will be happening in November. Put your seatbelt (or hockey helmet) on if you think the Coronavirus thread was a wild ride :-)
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: bizaro86 on May 13, 2020, 07:21:23 PM
I think it's a bit better. A few posters have really upped their game lately (shout out to thepupil and he collection of REITs with a free one-liner).

I dont read the coronavirus thread at all after concluding it was doing me more harm than good though, so that might color my opinion.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: merkhet on May 13, 2020, 07:43:47 PM
In aggregate, this forum has gotten worse since around 2013 or so. I remember there were people talking about this back then and the response was that it would get better when markets tanked again because the old posters would come back -- that hasn't happened, but, as bizaro86 said, post-COVID, there have been some great posts by a few folks on here.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: thepupil on May 13, 2020, 07:45:52 PM
A few posters have really upped their game lately (shout out to thepupil and he collection of REITs with a free one-liner).

Quitting a stable job at the start of a global recession/depression does help one post a lot 😀

You all have me for 4 more weeks...then my days belong to my new employer!

Iím going out with a bang, so many worthless buildings to buy before then!

Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: BG2008 on May 13, 2020, 08:36:06 PM
A few posters have really upped their game lately (shout out to thepupil and he collection of REITs with a free one-liner).

Quitting a stable job at the start of a global recession/depression does help one post a lot 😀

You all have me for 4 more weeks...then my days belong to my new employer!

Iím going out with a bang, so many worthless buildings to buy before then!

Thepupil,

Can you update us on what you are doing job wise?  I remember you mentioning it in a few of your posts.  I hope you'll be able to post as freely in 4 more weeks.  Would hate to lose your awesome high octane posts!!
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: LC on May 13, 2020, 10:19:51 PM
In aggregate, this forum has gotten worse since around 2013 or so. I remember there were people talking about this back then and the response was that it would get better when markets tanked again because the old posters would come back -- that hasn't happened, but, as bizaro86 said, post-COVID, there have been some great posts by a few folks on here.

I agree some really good posters have reduced or eliminated their activity. However I was  reading some old threads from 2011-2014 (or so) and was expecting the dialogue to be at a higher level - but actually I found it very similar to recent years. I was surprised to be seeing personal attacks, political bickering, faulty logic (your returns sucked last year, your analysis must be wrong!), etc.

I think perhaps there is some nostalgia at play :D

Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Mephistopheles on May 13, 2020, 11:10:55 PM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: rkbabang on May 14, 2020, 05:50:51 AM
I voted "just fine same as ever was".  I haven't read the coronavirus thread at all, so maybe that has shielded me from what others are experiencing.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: cherzeca on May 14, 2020, 06:48:54 AM
I have noticed an increase in emotion and contentiousness, to which I have contributed and for which I apologize.  I have also noticed a decrease in posts (threads really, or posts back and forth among a few posters that examine an issue from pretty much all sides) that I find truly insightful.  the economic effect of the corona shutdown when coupled with the advent of a potus election cycle make this a rather disconcerting time.  I have reacted by posting too much on matters that I know much too little about, when compared to the single topic that I believe I know a good deal about.  this may be called venting, which does not benefit the board.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: BG2008 on May 14, 2020, 08:02:11 AM
A few posters have really upped their game lately (shout out to thepupil and he collection of REITs with a free one-liner).

Quitting a stable job at the start of a global recession/depression does help one post a lot 😀

You all have me for 4 more weeks...then my days belong to my new employer!

Iím going out with a bang, so many worthless buildings to buy before then!

Thepupil,

Can you update us on what you are doing job wise?  I remember you mentioning it in a few of your posts.  I hope you'll be able to post as freely in 4 more weeks.  Would hate to lose your awesome high octane posts!!

Just want to add that Pupil's post along exhibits power law dynamics that makes this forum much more valuable since Covid. 
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: mjohn707 on May 14, 2020, 08:20:47 AM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous
kraven, yeah that names sounds familiar, but it's tough to know if he ever really existed or was just a legend.  I've heard recently, and it's hard to know what is true, two contradictory rumors about his current whereabouts and activities, and I'll present both here for the sake of fairness and in pursuit of the absolute truth:

The first thing I heard was that he had taken an unpaid internship with a millennial hedge fund manager, and was working on transitioning his investment style to a high-growth ďcompounderĒ approach.  The person who relayed this to me is notoriously unreliable however, but perhaps it contains at least some kernel of truth to it.

The second possibility, and again perhaps this is just rumor or hearsay, is that he had holed up in some sort of river valley or perhaps gulch, that name of which I canít remember, with the last holdouts of the deep-value approach, and planned to return someday in some Arthurian way to reestablish that approach to investing forever.

In my own judgment, I find it difficult to judge between these two as they both seem equally probable, and of course you can never discount the additional possibility that Iíve been misinformed entirely
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: merkhet on May 14, 2020, 11:12:15 AM
In aggregate, this forum has gotten worse since around 2013 or so. I remember there were people talking about this back then and the response was that it would get better when markets tanked again because the old posters would come back -- that hasn't happened, but, as bizaro86 said, post-COVID, there have been some great posts by a few folks on here.

I agree some really good posters have reduced or eliminated their activity. However I was  reading some old threads from 2011-2014 (or so) and was expecting the dialogue to be at a higher level - but actually I found it very similar to recent years. I was surprised to be seeing personal attacks, political bickering, faulty logic (your returns sucked last year, your analysis must be wrong!), etc.

I think perhaps there is some nostalgia at play :D

That could be true! I recall thinking the signal to noise ratio was better back then, but I could be wrong!
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: TwoCitiesCapital on May 14, 2020, 11:46:28 AM
I think it depends on the thread. I've basically stopped visiting Tesla and Coronovirus threads. The content is shit and they have just devolved into dick-measuring contests between posters who are getting personal in attacking one another.

Other threads seem about the same quality. No doubt that this forum has lost some HUGE contributors over time. Eric doesn't seem to post as much, though he's around from time to time. On the flipside, we've picked up new folks like Cherzeca who's had invaluable contributions to the Fannie/Freddie thread.

All in all, it seems roughly the same - maybe a slight decrease in quality in generally, but I just ignore those threads where reasoned discourse is unwelcome.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Jurgis on May 14, 2020, 11:52:30 AM
Coronavirus thread is great and has tons of useful information.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: cherzeca on May 14, 2020, 11:56:07 AM
"I think it depends on the thread. I've basically stopped visiting Tesla and Coronovirus threads. The content is shit and they have just devolved into dick-measuring contests between posters who are getting personal in attacking one another."

yes, I have seen more of this and I have contributed to this unfortunately, while not intending to have my member(ship) measured though...
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: thepupil on May 14, 2020, 12:34:50 PM
A few posters have really upped their game lately (shout out to thepupil and he collection of REITs with a free one-liner).

Quitting a stable job at the start of a global recession/depression does help one post a lot 😀

You all have me for 4 more weeks...then my days belong to my new employer!

Iím going out with a bang, so many worthless buildings to buy before then!

Thepupil,

Can you update us on what you are doing job wise?  I remember you mentioning it in a few of your posts.  I hope you'll be able to post as freely in 4 more weeks.  Would hate to lose your awesome high octane posts!!

Just want to add that Pupil's post along exhibits power law dynamics that makes this forum much more valuable since Covid.

thanks, I feel that I've provided excellent alpha shorts to the board. I disguise them as longs/starter positions.

Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Foreign Tuffett on May 15, 2020, 09:28:16 AM
I think the core problem with this forum is that informed posts about investment ideas take significant time and effort to craft, while nonsense* takes minimal time and effort.

Because posting these types of things is very easy, they constitute the majority of the posts on this forum on any given day. As they are so numerous, they tend to crowd out out excellent posts by thoughtful investors like Heilko, writser, Johnny, BG2008, benhacker, merkhet, etc.



* Human linkbotting, trolling, posts stating or implying that the poster possesses knowledge or understanding that he doesn't actually have, emotivist outbursts ("I like this stock! Hurrah for this stock!"), responding to posts without reading them carefully, ad hominem attacks, etc.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Read the Footnotes on May 31, 2020, 03:37:40 PM
I have to say I think the board has been excellent for the past day or two. There have been some very interesting discussions of businesses and invest-able ideas. Even some of the discussions in the Politics section have been respectful and illuminating.

I also appreciate Longhaul's contributions on the Psychology of Misjudgment. It's great to see someone going out of their way to create worthwhile content.

https://www.cornerofberkshireandfairfax.ca/forum/general-discussion/munger-and-psychology-of-misjudgement-cobf-class-idea/

https://www.cornerofberkshireandfairfax.ca/forum/general-discussion/psychology-of-misjudgment-cobf-class-2-likingloving-tendency/
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Read the Footnotes on May 31, 2020, 03:47:25 PM
I have noticed an increase in emotion and contentiousness, to which I have contributed and for which I apologize. 

...

 the economic effect of the corona shutdown when coupled with the advent of a potus election cycle make this a rather disconcerting time.  I have reacted by posting too much on matters that I know much too little about, when compared to the single topic that I believe I know a good deal about.  this may be called venting, which does not benefit the board.
Cherzeca, I wanted to complement you on this post. I think it is rare to see an apology and rare to see someone making an honest assessment of their behavior. Charlie Munger also says we should rub our own noses in it, try to be rational and try to stick to our circle of competence. You seem to be displaying in this post a lot of the emotional skills and practices necessary to be a rational actor and to become a better investor.

I think that a lot of people were grieving for the what they lost from SARS-NCoV-2 and some still are. Anger and denial frequently go along with grief. I mention this in case it helps us to show a little more patience and compassion either online or in the real world.

Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: starmitt on June 01, 2020, 09:53:47 AM
I appreciate that the members are discussing this, and thinking about how discourse could be improved. Here is what I have noticed recently that I would like people to consider.

When posters engage in discussions on investing, there is predominantly at least the appearance of an effort to apply critical thought. When posters engage in discussions on politics, there is predominantly the appearance of regurgitating common beliefs. Very shallow. Even at least one thread I saw which revealed a lack of basic knowledge of civic functions/laws/powers.

Now it is easy enough for me to simply not click any thread that is non-financial, but here is the issue. People who think sloppily on one topic tend to think sloppily in general, and those who think rigorously tend to do so as a matter of course. So those that think sloppily are diluting investment threads, and those that think rigorously are diluting the poo-throwing political threads. And of course, you who are reading this know you are a rigorous thinker.  ;D

I think in a recent thread Sanjeev wrote that in the next iteration of this board, politics will be eliminated. I look forward to this. Even for the non-rigorous thinking posters, I suspect there will be a tendency to try to match the level of discourse.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Read the Footnotes on June 01, 2020, 11:30:22 AM
I appreciate that the members are discussing this, and thinking about how discourse could be improved. Here is what I have noticed recently that I would like people to consider.

When posters engage in discussions on investing, there is predominantly at least the appearance of an effort to apply critical thought. When posters engage in discussions on politics, there is predominantly the appearance of regurgitating common beliefs. Very shallow. Even at least one thread I saw which revealed a lack of basic knowledge of civic functions/laws/powers.

Now it is easy enough for me to simply not click any thread that is non-financial, but here is the issue. People who think sloppily on one topic tend to think sloppily in general, and those who think rigorously tend to do so as a matter of course. So those that think sloppily are diluting investment threads, and those that think rigorously are diluting the poo-throwing political threads. And of course, you who are reading this know you are a rigorous thinker.  ;D

I think in a recent thread Sanjeev wrote that in the next iteration of this board, politics will be eliminated. I look forward to this. Even for the non-rigorous thinking posters, I suspect there will be a tendency to try to match the level of discourse.
I think the level of discourse including in the Politics board has been much higher for the past three days and that the sloppy thinking is actually much better.

I am also happy to see that the Political discussion has moved back in to the Politics section.

I think you are right that lazy thinking in one area can lead to lazy thinking in another area. I actually think it's worse than that though, I think what we have seen is a good bit of emotional garbage without even the attempt of creating posts that are of any use to anyone else. That sort of behavior can really drive out the good contributors whereas a thoughtful and respectful discussion actually draws people in to the discussion.

I think the past couple of days we have since a realization of what I was saying when several times I have posted that it's not about what CoB&F is, but what it could be.

We owe thanks to Sanjeev for the relatively unrecognized job of keeping the standards as high as they are.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: clutch on June 01, 2020, 11:35:08 AM
When discussing investments, people are often willing to hear other opposing thoughts that challenge them. It's part of the due diligence process.

When discussing politics, that is rarely the case. They (and myself included) are simply reinforcing their beliefs.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Read the Footnotes on June 01, 2020, 01:03:57 PM
When discussing investments, people are often willing to hear other opposing thoughts that challenge them. It's part of the due diligence process.

When discussing politics, that is rarely the case. They (and myself included) are simply reinforcing their beliefs.
Before it was known as "Economics" the field was known as "Political Economy"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_economy

In fact, it was likely known as Political Economy for longer than it was known as Economics.

I would accept that a discussion of economics is likely a waste of time, especially a discussion of Macro Economics. On the other hand, if you think discussing economics is of value, then you should recognize that the two can be very difficult to separate. Plus there is the rare occasion upon which you can make a dollar based on a political insight.

Hopefully we can all try to do more than reinforce our own beliefs, or as Munger puts it . . . pound in our own stupidity.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: decko on June 16, 2020, 01:44:15 PM
I still find it relevant... I have to admit  our site was proactive in discussing the dangers of covid months in advance to the major decline.. I am fairly new to the site and I get plenty of responses to my questions and intelligent thought.  Hopefully i can add value from time to time.   Thank you
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: CorpRaider on September 12, 2020, 08:26:19 AM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous

Anyone know how Kraven is doing? I was just thinking about him earlier today.  I was re-reading some quant stuff which led me to some antitrust legal canon concerning how Porter's Five Forces is basically bunk.  I had a similar personal realization with M. Gladwell's stuff.  I think my journey toward quant-esque investing has been probably kind of similar to his.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: Gregmal on September 12, 2020, 09:41:06 AM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous

Anyone know how Kraven is doing? I was just thinking about him earlier today.  I was re-reading some quant stuff which led me to some antitrust legal canon concerning how Porter's Five Forces is basically bunk.  I had a similar personal realization with M. Gladwell's stuff.  I think my journey toward quant-esque investing has been probably kind of similar to his.

I dont think I was here while he was an active poster, but we exchanged messages a little bit ago. He can chime in if he's still following but the gist was similar to what a lot of us have acknowledged the past few years. There is not a ton of unique investment related discussion here, and the investment related discussion that does take place, is often in the same trite names and largely an echo chamber...BRK, FFH, etc.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: John Hjorth on September 12, 2020, 11:47:57 AM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous

Anyone know how Kraven is doing? I was just thinking about him earlier today.  I was re-reading some quant stuff which led me to some antitrust legal canon concerning how Porter's Five Forces is basically bunk.  I had a similar personal realization with M. Gladwell's stuff.  I think my journey toward quant-esque investing has been probably kind of similar to his.

I dont think I was here while he was an active poster, but we exchanged messages a little bit ago. He can chime in if he's still following but the gist was similar to what a lot of us have acknowledged the past few years. There is not a ton of unique investment related discussion here, and the investment related discussion that does take place, is often in the same trite names and largely an echo chamber...BRK, FFH, etc.

The mere concept of anchoring to the past.
Title: Re: Since Covid Lockdown, has this site's posting improved, worsened or meh?
Post by: CorpRaider on September 12, 2020, 05:25:43 PM
One of my favorite posters, Kraven, has been MIA in forever. Loved reading his posts, they were educational and humorous

Anyone know how Kraven is doing? I was just thinking about him earlier today.  I was re-reading some quant stuff which led me to some antitrust legal canon concerning how Porter's Five Forces is basically bunk.  I had a similar personal realization with M. Gladwell's stuff.  I think my journey toward quant-esque investing has been probably kind of similar to his.

I dont think I was here while he was an active poster, but we exchanged messages a little bit ago. He can chime in if he's still following but the gist was similar to what a lot of us have acknowledged the past few years. There is not a ton of unique investment related discussion here, and the investment related discussion that does take place, is often in the same trite names and largely an echo chamber...BRK, FFH, etc.

Yeah, he was more evidence-based quant-esque in style (in the tradition of like Graham and Schloss) unless memory escapes me so it's not like there was ever a ton of discrete exchanges of narrative on particular names (that I recall).  Probably going to take a real bloodbath for the galaxy names and some mean reversion to bring back a lot of interesting nuance/opportunity.