Author Topic: Republican Presidents kill people and crash the market, every single time  (Read 2270 times)

Castanza

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2020, 12:24:10 PM »
Table 5 is particularly interesting as it shows you which provides the marginal benefit (or cost) to each President. Bush (the 2nd), Trump and Reagan are the "worst offenders". Not surprising particularly with Bush, given post-911 military expenditures and bailouts during 2008 i.e. final year in office. Obama you can see benefit from a high starting position (again the bank bailouts) which were then repaid over his tenure. Trump's tax cut puts him in the red, but my guess is given the COVID spending, he will look historically the worst.

Looking at it from a taxpayer standpoint it seems that a Democratic President and a Republican House are the best combination (marginal at best). But this doesn’t show “attempts” to spend more so draw from it what you want.

To Parsads point....they are absolutely all guilty.


rb

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2020, 01:56:05 PM »
Table 5 is particularly interesting as it shows you which provides the marginal benefit (or cost) to each President. Bush (the 2nd), Trump and Reagan are the "worst offenders". Not surprising particularly with Bush, given post-911 military expenditures and bailouts during 2008 i.e. final year in office. Obama you can see benefit from a high starting position (again the bank bailouts) which were then repaid over his tenure. Trump's tax cut puts him in the red, but my guess is given the COVID spending, he will look historically the worst.

Looking at it from a taxpayer standpoint it seems that a Democratic President and a Republican House are the best combination (marginal at best). But this doesn’t show “attempts” to spend more so draw from it what you want.

To Parsads point....they are absolutely all guilty.
I think you're right if you're a libertarian and want nothing done.

The point is they both like to spend. The republican are worse cause they're MASSIVE hypocrites about the whole thing. They just like to spend on different things. Republicans like things that go boom and tax cuts. Democrats like health care and infrastructure.

If you like things that go boom and tax cuts then you need a republican president and a republican congress. If you want health care and infrastructure you need a democrat president and a democrat congress. On the balance is worse with a republican president and democrat congress than with a democrat president and a republican congress. That's because if you have a democrat president the republicans in congress will go full fiscal responsibility fundamentalist and won't approve a dime. If you have a republican president and a democrat congress you'll throw them some money for pet causes and they'll roll on stuff.

If you want gridlock it's probably better with a democrat in the white house because they're better at government. They'll put competent people in charge. To make sure trains run on time sort of things. Whereas republicans seems to not have a care in the world about that sort of thing.

Writing it all down i realize how messed up it actually is.

Vish_ram

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2020, 02:00:56 PM »
Look at the last 2 D & R presidents.

Clinton created surplus, stock market was great, no new wars

Obama's period was characterized by great stock market, pulling troops out of Iraq etc. American casualty count was almost nil

W - crash of 2008 after massive de-regulation, removal of financial checks and balances, trillion $ war with tremendous loss of lives

T - massive crash, uncontrolled pandemic, loss of lives (may range from 200K to up to million).

A President is supposed to keep Americans safe. He has singularly failed in his task.

sundin

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2020, 02:09:01 PM »
Judging stimulus spend following 9/11, GFC and Covid19 - I'm not sure how different the response would be whether the president is Republican or Democrat. These are well thought out prepared measures using advisory of the best minds in the country. The president's job is to market the spend.

Castanza

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2020, 02:29:25 PM »
Table 5 is particularly interesting as it shows you which provides the marginal benefit (or cost) to each President. Bush (the 2nd), Trump and Reagan are the "worst offenders". Not surprising particularly with Bush, given post-911 military expenditures and bailouts during 2008 i.e. final year in office. Obama you can see benefit from a high starting position (again the bank bailouts) which were then repaid over his tenure. Trump's tax cut puts him in the red, but my guess is given the COVID spending, he will look historically the worst.

Looking at it from a taxpayer standpoint it seems that a Democratic President and a Republican House are the best combination (marginal at best). But this doesn’t show “attempts” to spend more so draw from it what you want.

To Parsads point....they are absolutely all guilty.
I think you're right if you're a libertarian and want nothing done.

The point is they both like to spend. The republican are worse cause they're MASSIVE hypocrites about the whole thing. They just like to spend on different things. Republicans like things that go boom and tax cuts. Democrats like health care and infrastructure.

If you like things that go boom and tax cuts then you need a republican president and a republican congress. If you want health care and infrastructure you need a democrat president and a democrat congress. On the balance is worse with a republican president and democrat congress than with a democrat president and a republican congress. That's because if you have a democrat president the republicans in congress will go full fiscal responsibility fundamentalist and won't approve a dime. If you have a republican president and a democrat congress you'll throw them some money for pet causes and they'll roll on stuff.

If you want gridlock it's probably better with a democrat in the white house because they're better at government. They'll put competent people in charge. To make sure trains run on time sort of things. Whereas republicans seems to not have a care in the world about that sort of thing.

Writing it all down i realize how messed up it actually is.

I don’t want gridlock and most libertarians would agree with that. My question is why do we always need the government to be “doing” something? Have you ever went and looked at the list of laws that are signed every single year?

I’d prefer if the government fulfilled its function according to the constitution and left the rest up to the private market. There is also plenty of examples of big infrastructure type projects that the private market performs a better job. The development of the railroads are a great example.

Anyways, you’re absolutely right. The whole system (in its current state) is pretty messed up. It’s all about outing individuals against each other in class warfare and then pushing your own agenda. I’m not Republican or Democrat. I’ll vote either way and but I will say some of my “favorite politicians” have been Republicans. Most likely because they play the game and campaign under the “we’re fiscally responsible” platform the Republican Party “preaches”.

LC

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2020, 02:51:31 PM »
Judging stimulus spend following 9/11, GFC and Covid19 - I'm not sure how different the response would be whether the president is Republican or Democrat. These are well thought out prepared measures using advisory of the best minds in the country. The president's job is to market the spend.

The patsy's job is to market the spend. But generally I agree once a crisis is at your feet, you have to deal with it. The guy in charge of the federal government will usually go with a federal solution.

Seeing such incompetence from the Feds these days (i.e. idiot President, corrupt Congress), the libertarian approach is attractive. But that's a knee jerk reaction - my best guess is that going down that route will eliminate more of the good that the gov't does (which doesn't get much airfare) than critics imagine. Cutting off the nose to spite the face.
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Vish_ram

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2020, 07:31:12 AM »
Potential death count is already revised to 240K.

Without cure, and Florida governors reckless actions, this might as well reach 1M.

What is shocking about this virus is that healthy/young patients without any pre-existing conditions are dying due to cytokine storm. My wife is treating CV pts and she is in a shock at the exponential increase in pt load.

Spekulatius

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #17 on: April 01, 2020, 04:36:30 PM »
We get a lot of 100 year events in a relatively short timeframe. GFC was a hundred year event also and it just occurred 11 years ago. In a global deeply connected world , these type of events at bound to happen quite often, I think.

If you think about it, WW1, WW2 and the Great Depression were 100 year Events too and all but WW1 occurred less than 100 years ago.

Stuff like the Cuban missile crisis or SARS might have become 100 year events too, but didn’t, which probably was more luck and some heroism (in case of SARS) than anything else.
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LC

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #18 on: April 01, 2020, 04:58:47 PM »
100 year events are not 100 year events if they occur every decade.

Mandelbrot wrote about this regarding levees alongside rivers. Cities would experience 'once in a lifetime' floods, and then in the aftermath re-build the levees to deal with those flood levels. Years later the floods would return and now even higher - those previous levees again were swallowed.

The problem was not the height of the levees it's the fact that you've built a city right on top of a flood zone. In other words, solutions either address root causes or symptoms.
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Castanza

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Re: Republicans kill people and crash the market, every single time
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2020, 07:25:28 AM »
100 year events are not 100 year events if they occur every decade.

Mandelbrot wrote about this regarding levees alongside rivers. Cities would experience 'once in a lifetime' floods, and then in the aftermath re-build the levees to deal with those flood levels. Years later the floods would return and now even higher - those previous levees again were swallowed.

The problem was not the height of the levees it's the fact that you've built a city right on top of a flood zone. In other words, solutions either address root causes or symptoms.

Or go one step further like NO and build below sea level.